THE GREAT HIP HOP DEBATE: Truth Savior vs Dr. Derrick Colon.
THE GREAT HIP HOP DEBATE: Truth Savior vs Dr. Derrick Colon.
In every debate, each of the participants always feel that they won the encounter. It is not enough to say that you won. A person has to demonstrate beyond the shadow of a doubt that certain criteria have been met.
Such as:
Did the participants stick to the topic that was presented?
Did they prove their points beyond reasonable doubt?
Did they…
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MY RESPONSE TO THE DEBATE
By Dr. Derrick Colon
Point of clarification:
I accused Truth Savior of saying that John Griggs didn’t play Congas on give it up and turn it loose. He didn’t say that. He said he didn’t play congas for Ishmael Miranda. I apologize to truth for that. With that said, John Griggs did play congas, for Ishmael, Larry Harlow, and Fania. He was known as the master of percussion. Percussionist will often play more than one instrument.
I wanted to address a charge that was made by Truth Savior with regard to the idea that the Musicians from The Palladium, and the musicians from Birdland would go back and forth to jam with one another. Below you will find a video and an excerpt speaking to this fact.
https://youtu.be/7ClO3VQI8HI?si=ICA8gLgX-0-B5Y2b
The following excerpt is taken from jazzonthetube.com
“For those who missed it, Birdland, the shrine of bebop, and the Palladium Ballroom, the shrine of Latin jazz, were just a block away from each other.
The original Birdland opened December 15, 1949 at 1678 Broadway just north of West 52nd Street and closed in 1965.
The Palladium Ballroom opened in 1948 on the corner of 53rd Street and Broadway in New York City and closed May 1, 1966.
Musicians and audience members went back and forth between the two nightspots.
Jazzman Slim Gaillard and Tito Puente reminisce about the heyday – and then get down to a jam.”
When it came to the debate, Truth Savior never really dealt with the topic, “The Latin Breakdown and its connection to the BBoy anthems.” Instead he spoke about issues of race. He was really caught up with the definition of the word Descarga. He claimed that I gave the word some extra meaning. The word means an improvised jam session. When listening to a traditional Descarga, it is clear what this is and what this entails.
The following definition was taken from Last FM .com “A descarga (literally discharge in Spanish) is an improvised jam session consisting of variations on Cuban music themes, primarily son montuno, but also guajira, bolero, guaracha and rumba. The genre is strongly influenced by jazz and it was developed in Havana during the 1950s. Important figures in the emergence of the genre were Cachao, Julio Gutiérrez, Bebo Valdés, Peruchín and Niño Rivera in Cuba, and Tito Puente, Machito and Mario Bauzá in New York. Originally, descargas were promoted by record companies such as Panart, Maype and Gema under the label Cuban jam sessions. From the 1960s, the descarga format was usually adapted by large salsa ensembles, most notably the Fania All-Stars.”
If you notice all the people mentioned are Latino. Not one African American is brought up. His contention is that this was a direct result of being influenced by the Jazz musicians that came to Cuba. Improvised jam sessions have been happening in different forms since the beginning of time. The Indians did it, the Africans did it, the Tainos did it, the Cubans did it, the Puerto Ricans did it, and Hip Hop did it.
I added nothing new to the definition. I simply expounded on what took place, and what instruments were used. He then claimed that both Preston Epps and Dizzy Gillespie didn’t speak for all black people, to which I agreed. That was not my point when bringing up the fact that Epps said he or anybody ever saw the Conga or Bongo drums. This poked holes in his weak theories. He failed to deal with the real topic at hand. He never once spoke about the bboy anthems, or showed how there was no real connection to the Latin breakdown.
I explained in numerous points that the Latin breakdown could be found in the bboy anthems. The term Descarga means a breakdown of the instruments, and that is what you hear in the traditional bboy anthems. I gave example after example of how African American musicians were influenced by Latin flavor.
I would love to hear your thoughts.
Peace.
Jazz was Also A Jazz Singer Mimcking the Music while it's Playing that only FBA were ever heard Mimicking and Improvising through Jazz Music when Preforming which is apart of their Music Culture as you climb the Ladder to Hiphop right now☝🏾🙄🎶🎵🎼 FBA It's time to Stop giving Colon Clout 💲 ‼️ Moving onto the Next New Thing out weighs giving Life Putting up with this Chasers BS💯
In with those instruments in Puerto Rico they never invented a hip hop sound. Stopt it Colon.
So you might as well say Purieto Ricans investmented County ,Jazz R&B ,since Foundational Black Americans invented those as well. Colon is crazy.
Dr. Colon begins every lie witha a cough.😂
All colon brought to the debate was Him being an Ignorant Immigrant Knowing Nothing with Brilliance that it brought tears to my eyes👉🏾😂🤣😅
Derrick colon is a real first class b+ch. You have no truth in you dude – Please you any every other Imigrant Tether and Black American hater – LEAVE HIP HOP ALONE (and every other genre of music Black Americans created) –
You telling the same lie over and over again is not going to make it true- NOBODY INTELLIGENT BELIEVES YOU..NOBODY!! GET OVER IT DUDE AND GO LISTEN TO SOME PUERTO-RICAN music somewhere. I guarantee you, no black people will be there claiming that we helped create it.
And it was fortold that you would b+ch out of coming to the screening of micro phone check the movie- you say because a caller threatened you on Tariqs channel- That 1 little caller did you a big favor and gave you an excuse to stay your b+ch azz home. when really, nobody if focused on your coward whimpy azz. Good stay home- we didnt want to see your lying face any way.
CLOAKING FBA Cosplayin🎬BRB'S🚢🛶..Hidden😶🌫️TETHERISTS🚢🏝🌍🌐
Truth Savior to the rescue son 😂 “Dr” Colonizer is fraud and a joke son
Congas Dont Belong To Puerto Ricans! Anywhere The Negritos Was On The Island,, It Was Rhythm & Soul!!
All The Percussion Sounds Colon Heard In Black Music That Puerto ricans Were Dancing To Had Noting to With Spanish Music That Was Never Influential To Black Brothers!
Colon Hates Black Brothers Also Had Their Hands On Congas. Without Ever Meeting Anyone Latino!
All The Best Latin Music Was Created By Afro Latinos.The Men who Look Like BlackBrothers! Colon. Kniws That!
Big L no Lamont Senior Colon 🤣🤣🤣
An Elder once said " you can't pull that small time stuff over on us" get outta here Dr C
Im Hispanic and im telling Hispanic people . Let black Americans have this . Stop being desperate trying to claim hip-hop. It's garbage culture anyway. We good without that
He talking about you want to make it about race but everything especially around that time was about race what is you talking about ding dong
If the inspiration come from them at that time then the inspiration will continue until this day what is you talking about doc
Doc at some point u just gotta tap out and accept defeat u could be a great ambassador to hip-hop culture if u stop with the dastardly antics brody ur simply wrong
There is no such thing as a Latin breakdown…
Colon, im convinced you are trolling the FBA community. There’s no way you can be taking this many LLLLLLLL’s and still show your face to the public 😂😂😂😂
Colon tried to play the semantics game and lost by 100 😆
Why would Truth Savior disprove something (latin breakdown) that he told you does NOT exist. There is no such thing as a “latin breakdown” in our culture. You smokin that good dope..
Creating definitions out of thin air is crazy 😂😂😂
Lie-tinos are FANS/Haters only influence or creation I can give them is Latin food other than that it’s quite for them nobody on black Americans level I mean nobody black Americans are the creators, trendsetters, influence and 100% the culture this world copy everything black Americans do/did black Americans protect our culture and creations✊🏾🇺🇸✊🏾🇺🇸✊🏾
Yo Truth said "why are you using CUBAN culture to push you agenda…thats not your culture…YOUR PEURTO RICAN! What did your culture do!" Thats was a blow to him. 😂😂😂😂
People really think that black Americans didn't have poly drumming look at the step teams that a lot of black people take part of now since it's cool just like everything else black American started those are polyrhythms which was made by African-Americans are a combination of African drums like how Cuba have their version of the tom-toms the tomtom's on the American drum set reflect Africa very heavily and hamboning was the basis of how you would play a drum set at the time you're doing multiple different beats with multiple different body parts So when you say African-Americans didn't have polyrhythmic drum patterns that is totally false even up in New York with pinkster they practice freestyling Jim sessions with multiple drums and instruments that is a common thing that all African people have in common is freestyling even the way African-Americans play African drums are there any different
I finally listened to this whole debate and Dr Colom easily won this
The other dude wasn’t even on topic of the debate
Colon’s hip-hop debate record is a dismal 0-2. Randee punching the air.
Ladies and Gentlemen, shake your eye glasses to this
Colon easily smoked truth savior fba are looking like clowns😂😂😂
Colon reaching more than Strech Armstrong 😂
In no other country in the world would this happen
Because of his close ties to IE he is attempting to give us a Latin education
The descagra is clearly and strongly influenced by Jazz, a Black AMERICAN genre created in the 1920s.
We have a 30 year head start in the genre as Black people in America.Jazz is an improv genre. Latin Jazz comes in around the 1950s so how are we now using a Latin breakdown when Latinos are using a Black American genre ? The whole breakdown is still Jazz, created by Black Americans. We can do the break down with out the congas just using a drum kit my dude, lol. We can do the breakdown just with our hands on our bodies (Paton Juba) or making a beat on a table top, this genre is not centered around no bongos or congas Colon!
If the Latin Breakdown Descagra is so influential to Hip Hop, where is evidence of it in today’s Hip Hop music?
You also lied about the definition meaning “go off” or “get loose” and could not find a supporting document to also use the definition you used for descargra which leads me to believe you are lying to fit your narrative and makes your argument misleading
Colon got his ass handled to him but all this implying Africa influenced HIP-HOP is also false
Colon lied about the Deacarga definition and he did edit the definition. And the music did not only have the instruments he stated, there were horns etc lol
We are better than them in their own sh.t is want Colon is trying to say🤔🤭